Russian hacking?

Please put all polls here.

Did Russia directly &/or indirectly hack the 2016 election process?

Yes
16
33%
No
33
67%
 
Total votes: 49

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dru708
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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby dru708 » Tue Dec 13, 2016

tractorman wrote:Not to interrupt the spin doctors, but I'm still unclear on the facts. What, exactly, is the claim? Did Russia hack into the system and electronically "stuff the ballot box" from the Kremlin? Or did the KGB manipulate all US social networks and media with "fake news" and "influence the election" in that way? Or what, specifically? I apologize if this is common knowledge. I still haven't found a reliable news source that doesn't have an agenda.


Back in Oct the national security agencies were in agreement that Russia was digitally interfering in the election process.

The most recent release was that most, but not all, national security agencies believed that Russia not only interfered but deliberately tried to get Trump elected.

The first is pretty much a done deal. The second is where there is disagreement among the agencies.

Far as I know there are no detailed statements on exactly what the Russians were doing.
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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby silverpv » Tue Dec 13, 2016

John McCain, Mitch McConnell, Paul Ryan all back the investigation (i don't even like these guys). Those guys aren't liberals, democrats, or lefties. Sometimes you have to put your country ahead of ego, we're all Americans. Find out who did what and over what period of time. Companies like Google/Apple/FB do not erase data. All of it is stored and mined. The gov't on the other hand has a retention policy.

The problem is we aren't clear on facts because all the attention is on the content and not the hack. I would seriously like to know how long they've been trying to breach, what they were able to breach, where they've searched, what other places they've accessed. You have to follow the cookie crumbs. The gov't has resources like palantir to sift through and make use of large amounts of inter-related data.

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Tractor Man
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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby Tractor Man » Tue Dec 13, 2016

Thanks guys, I got it. Nobody knows. Influenced the election ... until we find out exactly what that means, its all just noise.
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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby silverpv » Tue Dec 13, 2016

tractorman wrote:Thanks guys, I got it. Nobody knows. Influenced the election ... until we find out exactly what that means, its all just noise.


Sort of. 100% the election was influenced because of those e-mails and leaks. The 'who' is noise. The 'what' is the content that is reality, which affected the outcome our political process since the content was used heavily.

Whether its Russia or someone else is the only question.

Maybe it was the mexicans!

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MasterBlaster
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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby MasterBlaster » Tue Dec 13, 2016

Surprised the USA doesn't do this kind of interference in other Countries elections :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby dru708 » Tue Dec 13, 2016

“Nothing in the RNC emails was as bad as what Trump was saying out loud.” –@StephenAtHome on why Russia didn’t release RNC emails #LSSC

Stephen Colbert

It's a JOKE
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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby Rik Bitter » Tue Dec 13, 2016

silverpv wrote:
tractorman wrote:Thanks guys, I got it. Nobody knows. Influenced the election ... until we find out exactly what that means, its all just noise.


Sort of. 100% the election was influenced because of those e-mails and leaks. The 'who' is noise. The 'what' is the content that is reality, which affected the outcome our political process since the content was used heavily.

Whether its Russia or someone else is the only question.

Maybe it was the mexicans!

Image


Could have been the Israelis, Jehovah knows, they owe us one.

Jerusalem, Israel — February 1, 2015 … Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s ruling Likud Party exposed a US related political marketing organization staffed with former Obama campaigners now working to defeat Netanyahu in an upcoming general election.

During a press conference Sunday, the Likud Party officially accused V15 and other related nonprofits of being supported “through millions of dollars funneled from Europe, the US and the New Israel Fund and international factors interested in bringing down Prime Minister Netanyahu” who think “that all means are appropriate.”


http://israelnewsagency.com/obama-seeking-netanyahu-defeat-sends-campaign-elections-team-israel/
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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby Bucketeer » Tue Dec 13, 2016

Long John wrote:It's interesting that the top Republicans, McConnell, Ryan, McCain, even Trump's vice president, and the CIA are saying the evidence points to Russia trying to manipulate the election."


The problem is obvious: the top Republicans, McConnell, Ryan, McCain. They were and continue to be the problem. CIA is still a political agency and it isn't Trump's party just yet. Most of Trump's supporters despise McConnell and Ryan.

jcz1 wrote:I was reminded today, and I'm sure someone can post a link to the video if they wish, that Trump specifically asked Russia to hack and publish Clinton's emails./quote]


The only people that failed to see the humor in Trump's statement were either the "mainstream media (drive-by media) OR people who live in: NYC, Boston, Chicago, LA/SF, and the Beltway. These "sanctuaries" are notorious for being hotbeds of liberalism, and the humorless and soullessness outlook of the liberal ideology. The crime rates are notorious too.

I hope that Trump does 4 things in his 1st 100 days. 1) Break the spirit of Ryan/McConnell. That shouldn't be hard. 2) Forgot about any thoughts of bi-partisanism. Trump won, so bring his name picks from the business/military communities and keep the professional politicians to a bare minimum. No need to "reach across the aisle" (yuck - a very scary thought). 3) Fast-break his strong-man policies, making the liberal leadership looking even more weak, impotent, and unable to respond. It is really refreshing to hear China spouting off daily about what a "meanie" Mr. Trump is.

Item #4 - Trump should continue to torment the mainstream media. They will never cut him a fair break, so he might as well continue to use his Twitter account. I hope he goes after Bezo's/Amazon/WaPo on anti-trust. WaPo and CNN are the biggest liars in the media.

Remember this: The job of a journalist ISN'T to discover the truth, it is to follow the story and "make it fit" (interesting) to the widest range of readers/viewers. That sells ads so the advertisers can market junk to the readers and viewers they really don't need.

I'd really like to see Rush Limbaugh as head of the FCC.
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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby Tractor Man » Tue Dec 13, 2016

silverpv wrote:
tractorman wrote:Thanks guys, I got it. Nobody knows. Influenced the election ... until we find out exactly what that means, its all just noise.


Sort of. 100% the election was influenced because of those e-mails and leaks. The 'who' is noise. The 'what' is the content that is reality, which affected the outcome our political process since the content was used heavily.

Whether its Russia or someone else is the only question.

Maybe it was the mexicans!


Is that all there is to this newest "Russian hacking" media blast? We all know that the emails being exposed influenced the election. The rebuttal is to attack the messenger? I'm going to need more than that.
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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby dru708 » Tue Dec 13, 2016

tractorman wrote:
silverpv wrote:
tractorman wrote:Thanks guys, I got it. Nobody knows. Influenced the election ... until we find out exactly what that means, its all just noise.


Sort of. 100% the election was influenced because of those e-mails and leaks. The 'who' is noise. The 'what' is the content that is reality, which affected the outcome our political process since the content was used heavily.

Whether its Russia or someone else is the only question.

Maybe it was the mexicans!


Is that all there is to this newest "Russian hacking" media blast? We all know that the emails being exposed influenced the election. The rebuttal is to attack the messenger? I'm going to need more than that.


This latest one is whether Russia tried to help get Trump elected. The emails would be part of that, but not all.

Yes the attack would be directed toward Russia.
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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby Engineer » Tue Dec 13, 2016

tractorman wrote:
silverpv wrote:
tractorman wrote:Thanks guys, I got it. Nobody knows. Influenced the election ... until we find out exactly what that means, its all just noise.


Sort of. 100% the election was influenced because of those e-mails and leaks. The 'who' is noise. The 'what' is the content that is reality, which affected the outcome our political process since the content was used heavily.

Whether its Russia or someone else is the only question.

Maybe it was the mexicans!


Is that all there is to this newest "Russian hacking" media blast? We all know that the emails being exposed influenced the election. The rebuttal is to attack the messenger? I'm going to need more than that.


Other foreign governments (Saudi Arabia, etc) and a convicted felon (Soros) influenced the election by supporting Clinton...yet there's no outrage about that.

The only thing we know for sure is the media blast is biased...and the reporter who got suspended for fake news is ranting about fake news.
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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby joefro » Tue Dec 13, 2016

dru708 wrote:
joefro wrote:

dru708 wrote:
As far as those emails I put them in with gossip & rumor. And give the same amount of credibility.



Again, the fact that democrats have been silent about the content of what was exposed, but very vocal about the source of the leaks speaks volumes to the credibility of the content, IMO. Podesta has all but said everything released from his e-mails is legit.


Yea that would be me.

I simply don't care about Clinton or her email. Either charge her with a crime or let's move on.

Has no one else been on an Internet message board that was hacked???

Consider a theoretical for a moment. Person X joins BS. Hacks into Person Y's private messages and posts them in public. Either here or RC or Doc Silvers or ?. The pm's are quite harsh on a personal level.

While I might be disappointed by Person Y's conversation, I'd be livid at Person X cause that would threaten us all.

Am I disappointed by Clintons emails? Good Lord no. Only a political noob would be surprised. Whoever hacked in is a threat.


In this whole post you are basically saying you dont care about the content of Clinton's email. I agree, I am not surprised about it. But that is very different from saying you dont think the content of the leaks was credible, which was your original statement.

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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby dru708 » Tue Dec 13, 2016

joefro wrote:
dru708 wrote:
joefro wrote:

dru708 wrote:
As far as those emails I put them in with gossip & rumor. And give the same amount of credibility.



Again, the fact that democrats have been silent about the content of what was exposed, but very vocal about the source of the leaks speaks volumes to the credibility of the content, IMO. Podesta has all but said everything released from his e-mails is legit.


Yea that would be me.

I simply don't care about Clinton or her email. Either charge her with a crime or let's move on.

Has no one else been on an Internet message board that was hacked???

Consider a theoretical for a moment. Person X joins BS. Hacks into Person Y's private messages and posts them in public. Either here or RC or Doc Silvers or ?. The pm's are quite harsh on a personal level.

While I might be disappointed by Person Y's conversation, I'd be livid at Person X cause that would threaten us all.

Am I disappointed by Clintons emails? Good Lord no. Only a political noob would be surprised. Whoever hacked in is a threat.


In this whole post you are basically saying you dont care about the content of Clinton's email. I agree, I am not surprised about it. But that is very different from saying you dont think the content of the leaks was credible, which was your original statement.


I have doubts about what a gossip tells me. If they will tell me about you, they'll also tell you about me. aka never trust a gossip.
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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby silverpv » Tue Dec 13, 2016

Engineer wrote:
tractorman wrote:
silverpv wrote:
tractorman wrote:Thanks guys, I got it. Nobody knows. Influenced the election ... until we find out exactly what that means, its all just noise.


Sort of. 100% the election was influenced because of those e-mails and leaks. The 'who' is noise. The 'what' is the content that is reality, which affected the outcome our political process since the content was used heavily.

Whether its Russia or someone else is the only question.

Maybe it was the mexicans!


Is that all there is to this newest "Russian hacking" media blast? We all know that the emails being exposed influenced the election. The rebuttal is to attack the messenger? I'm going to need more than that.


Other foreign governments (Saudi Arabia, etc) and a convicted felon (Soros) influenced the election by supporting Clinton...yet there's no outrage about that.

The only thing we know for sure is the media blast is biased...and the reporter who got suspended for fake news is ranting about fake news.


Tractorman: the messenger is Assange, they are not attacking him. They are looking for the intruder, the people who actually broke into these accounts with the intent to sway the election. Personally, I think it IS the Russian gov't because of all the sanctions placed on them as a result of the Ukraine invasion and annexation of crimea in 2014. The US is interfering with their business, economy, sovereignty, and currency causing the ruble to devalue earlier in the year. There's plenty of reasons why Putin would want some payback.

Engineer: Sure there is outrage. The pro-trump media blasts it continuously about Saudi and Soros backing Clinton. If you google 'soros support clinton', 467,000 results. 53,000 news articles. I think that's quite a lot of articles in 18 months. It was heavily campaigned on. BUT Trump is celebrating $45 billion from Saudi Arabia "investment" in the US. Where's your outrage there? Where is your outrage of Linda McMahon who donated $5 million to Trump foundation and another $6 mil for his super pac and was appointed to his cabinet as secretary of small business? Rex Tillerson, CEO of Exxon mobil, as Secretary of state? Does it depend on the party line or is being "American" paramount over 'party'? You really have to ask is replacing politicians with Billionaire CEO's really going to look out for the avg. person? Gary Cohn as Economic advisor, CEO of Goldman Sachs. Steven Mnuchin Goldman alum as Treasury Secretary? We don't need lobbyists when they are in the cabinet.

Also if you talk about 'influencing' via campaign. That's completely different than breaking the law to do so. That's a very dangerous precedent. That is like saying a burglar can submit evidence against you if find "evidence", while stealing your other stuff and maybe breaking into your house too. You would basically be justifying Nixon's watergate. No one knows who stole the info. That is what is pertinent information. You know soros and saudi. You don't know who Assange, a foreign national is working for. If it was leaked by an insider, that's ok. There are protection laws for that. It makes a huge difference if it is a foreign country or an insider. The content is known, now we must know the motive. If you are ok with the result just because you won. That seems a little bias doesn't it? Wouldn't you want to know if someone cheated for you to win? or is the win more important?

2017-2020 is going to be an interesting 4 years!

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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby Engineer » Tue Dec 13, 2016

Silverpv,

I'm wondering if any of the Trump cabinet members you mentioned are felons with active warrants like Soros. If not, it's kind of an apples to oranges comparison.

Regarding breaking the law for foreign nationals to influence campaigns, Obama seemed to be a master of the art. Liberals were more than happy to overlook the facts, yet somehow you expect conservatives to behave differently? It seems like a double standard.

http://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2012/10/08/exposing_barack_obamas_illegal_foreign_campaign_money_loophole

Regarding Assange, it's pretty clear that he works for himself, and has established an impeccable reputation of releasing only verified material. The motives of those who leaked to him may be questionable, but the attacks on Assange are baseless.

PS - Assange hasn't been seen in person since his internet was cut (at the request of the US gov) prior to the election. There's a good chance he's dead.

In the meanwhile, here's just one of the stories being ignored by the US media:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jun/07/child-sex-abuse-whistleblower-resigns-from-un
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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby silverpv » Tue Dec 13, 2016

Engineer wrote:Silverpv,

I'm wondering if any of the Trump cabinet members you mentioned are felons with active warrants like Soros. If not, it's kind of an apples to oranges comparison.

Regarding breaking the law for foreign nationals to influence campaigns, Obama seemed to be a master of the art. Liberals were more than happy to overlook the facts, yet somehow you expect conservatives to behave differently? It seems like a double standard.

http://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2012/10/08/exposing_barack_obamas_illegal_foreign_campaign_money_loophole

Regarding Assange, it's pretty clear that he works for himself, and has established an impeccable reputation of releasing only verified material. The motives of those who leaked to him may be questionable, but the attacks on Assange are baseless.

PS - Assange hasn't been seen in person since his internet was cut (at the request of the US gov) prior to the election. There's a good chance he's dead.


The cabinet members have obviously screwed the environment and the economy but they are too large of an organization. Besides now you are splitting. There are plenty of questionable people that support Trump. Like the white supremacist groups. That was a good deflection though from the Saudis though.

Soros has an active warrant in Russia, not the US. From what I checked out for manipulating currency. The irony again is that Assange has an active warrant too but his involvement is kosher.

Yes Assange works for himself. Like I said, he's a content distributor. The question is who leaked. As far as masters of the law, I think Trump touted himself on being a master of the law because he has the best lawyers, who do a great job determining the law. I don't question that. It's the thought that some people think Trump is different but does the same stuff just like you said. He is no different, the only difference is bringing the money directly to the table. Trump is also not a conservative.

The question for me is 'The Who' and why they want him there. What do they expect to gain, what is the master plan? Chess, not checkers

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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby Engineer » Tue Dec 13, 2016

There are plenty of questionable people that support Trump. Like the white supremacist groups. That was a good deflection though from the Saudis though.


After all the BS allegations of racism in the last year, using it in an argument is the new measure of Godwin's Law. :pop:

So your problem with Trumps cabinet members is being too large to prosecute. How the hell is that different than Hillary, Pelosi, Reid, Ryan, McConnel, or any of the other Democrat leaders? They all seem to be made of teflon.

At least with Trump, they're people who have made money rather than taken money through graft.

Regarding Assange's warrant, it has been traced back to the Clinton Foundation via Claire and Todd...unsurprisingly, sex allegations just as Hillary made against Trump.

As for why Trump is in office, your guess is as good as mine...possibly better since I enticed people to vote against Trump by betting for him to win.

If I had to guess, he's there solely to disrupt the globalist agenda. I'm ok with that.
The year 2017: Where words and ideas are considered too hateful to be said,
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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby agnostic » Tue Dec 13, 2016

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Double3
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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby Double3 » Tue Dec 13, 2016

MasterBlaster wrote:Surprised the USA doesn't do this kind of interference in other Countries elections :lol: :lol: :lol:

This is kids play compared to the amount of interference that the US has done.

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Re: Russian hacking?

Postby Double3 » Tue Dec 13, 2016

silverpv wrote:John McCain, Mitch McConnell, Paul Ryan all back the investigation (i don't even like these guys). Those guys aren't liberals, democrats, or lefties.

But they are part of the machine.

These people and the people like them are scared of their way of life changing. They are the problem.

All this crap including the recount are ways they are trying to delegitimize Trump as president elect.


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